Surprising History of the Original McDonald's Location in San Bernadino, California | Route 66 Road Trip
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Take a Route 66 road trip to San Bernardino and explore the hidden history of the original McDonald’s location. Scott and Jenn trace the story behind this landmark, share what makes it a memorable stop for history travel, and tell you the darker side of McDonald's that most people don't know.
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Transcript
It's 1948, and you're pulling off Route 66 onto 14th and E Street
Speaker:in San Bernardino, California.
Speaker:Two brothers from New Hampshire, Maurice, Mac, and Richard, Dick McDonald, shut down
Speaker:their popular drive-in barbecue restaurant to test a radical streamlined experiment.
Speaker:A stripped-down menu of 10-cent burgers, fries, and shakes served in
Speaker:paper wrappers in under 30 seconds.
Speaker:They called it the Speedee Service System.
Speaker:Didn't just work, it sparked a revolution that permanently transformed American
Speaker:dining, car culture, and suburban life.
Speaker:Then in 1954, a struggling milkshake machine salesman named Ray Kroc walked in.
Speaker:Stunned by an order for eight multi-mixers, he saw that what the
Speaker:brothers didn't, an empire that could stretch across every highway in the world.
Speaker:What followed was a ruthless corporate clash, a broken handshake agreement over
Speaker:royalties, the brothers forced to rename their own restaurant, and a corporate
Speaker:titan taking over the golden arches while leaving the original founders in the dust.
Speaker:While the original restaurant was demolished in 1972, today the ground
Speaker:it stood on has been resurrected as a nostalgic, one-of-a-kind
Speaker:roadside museum preserving the true story of how it all began.
Speaker:Welcome to Talk With History.
Speaker:One filmmaker, one historian leading history-inspired world
Speaker:travels for the curious, the history lovers, and the explorer in us all.
Speaker:I'm your host, Scott, here with my wife and historian, Jenn.
Speaker:Hello.
Speaker:And former McDonald's crew member- … Jenn.
Speaker:Today our Route 66 road trip pulls into San Bernardino, California to visit
Speaker:the site of the original McDonald's.
Speaker:We're diving headfirst into waves of childhood nostalgia, walking past
Speaker:vintage Playland equipment like the Hamburglar climbing gym, looking back
Speaker:at generations of Happy Meal toys, and checking out retro employee uniforms.
Speaker:But we're also digging into the complicated and controversial corporate
Speaker:feud bef- between the McDonald brothers and Ray Kroc, brought to mainstream
Speaker:attention by the movie The Founder.
Speaker:We talk with local museum historian Marvin about how the site survived,
Speaker:why 60% of their visitors come from outside the United States, and how
Speaker:the late museum founder rescued the property to preserve the true
Speaker:history for Mother Road travelers.
Speaker:I'm Scott Bennie, so grab your french fries and step up to the counter.
Speaker:We're exploring the original McDonald's along Route 66.
Speaker:All right, Jenn.
Speaker:So this was a place that I actually grew up not far from here.
Speaker:San Bernardino, California is not far from where I grew up in San Dimas.
Speaker:But you never went.
Speaker:But I never went 'cause I never knew of this place because from
Speaker:what I've read, this is the original M- McDonald's location.
Speaker:Now, there's another place in the LA area that claims to be the original McDonald's,
Speaker:but I think it's kind of the, the first one, earliest one that's surviving.
Speaker:Okay, so this is interesting.
Speaker:So-
Speaker:Because of that controversy and how much McDonald- Ray Kroc was so mad-
Speaker:Yep … that he didn't get this original McDonald's, that they really go out of
Speaker:their way to say the original McDonald's restaurant is in Downey, California.
Speaker:Is in Downey.
Speaker:And again, Downey, if you don't know the LA area, this is, like,
Speaker:sprawling suburban Los Angeles.
Speaker:Mm-hmm.
Speaker:This is probably- From, like, Los Angeles.
Speaker:Los Angeles is probably, like, an hour.
Speaker:Yeah.
Speaker:Right?
Speaker:Now, they, we say LA, and that encompasses, like, a bajillion
Speaker:cities and, like, hours and hours of driving around Los Angeles.
Speaker:But San Bernardino, as you're coming from, if you've been listening to us
Speaker:for, for a little while, as you're coming along Route 66 and you're leaving
Speaker:Arizona, if you decide to go through Seligman, that's kinda the last part.
Speaker:Uh, if you go through Seligman and then Oatman- Mm-hmm … which is where the
Speaker:donkeys are- Mm-hmm … which we've talked about on a previous episode, um, you'll
Speaker:drive through Needles and then you'll come into California through, through Needles.
Speaker:Mm-hmm.
Speaker:And it gets really hot.
Speaker:The gas gets really expensive.
Speaker:You also get to find In-N-Out, which we were very excited about.
Speaker:On our, on our r- on our road trip, that's the first place we stopped
Speaker:in California to eat was In-N-Out.
Speaker:Yes.
Speaker:Um, not McDonald's.
Speaker:Mm. But we ended up staying just outside of San Bernardino or, or not
Speaker:too far- Mm-hmm … from the hotel.
Speaker:And the land where the original 1940s McDonald's restaurant was is
Speaker:now this museum, and that's where we stopped there and learned some
Speaker:really interesting history, as well as saw some really cool nostalgic
Speaker:Happy Meal toys and all the stuff.
Speaker:It was really neat.
Speaker:It was neat, and I was not aware of this huge controversy- I
Speaker:wasn't either
Speaker:… with Ray Kroc and the McDonald brothers.
Speaker:So this location opened in 1940.
Speaker:This was Dick and Mac McDonald, who Scott introduced.
Speaker:Um, they have a barbecue restaurant here, and they have, uh, car hops.
Speaker:They have where you could pull in.
Speaker:Think of it, he said, even the video like a, like a Sonic, where you pull
Speaker:in and they run out the food, and it's barbecue, and they have burgers
Speaker:and fries and things like that.
Speaker:And they have 25 menu items, but they soon become, like, a number one teen hangout.
Speaker:All these teenagers wanna come here, and they notice what's being
Speaker:ordered the most is hamburgers and fries, hamburgers and fries.
Speaker:And so they figured in 1948, what if we changed this to just have a small menu,
Speaker:cheeseburgers, hamburgers, fries, and milkshakes, and we just do it quick.
Speaker:We do something small and do it quick and get it to them
Speaker:fast, fast food, and do it well.
Speaker:And so they order a bunch of these shake machine makers, and
Speaker:the person who represents the malt maker machines is Ray Kroc.
Speaker:Yeah, so he was essentially a salesman for this- milkshake-making machine company
Speaker:Yes.
Speaker:And when he visits them, he sees how well they're doing and how popular it is,
Speaker:and how fast they can get the food out.
Speaker:And so he recommends franchising.
Speaker:He says, "What if I become your salesman and go out and franchise this?
Speaker:We'll franchise the cheeseburger, hamburger, and the french
Speaker:fries and the- Yeah, the,
Speaker:the Speedee Service system
Speaker:… the Speedee Service system.
Speaker:And so that's the first kind of emblem of McDonald's.
Speaker:And again, it's named for them, their last name, McDonald's.
Speaker:And he goes out and does that.
Speaker:And he does a very successful job, and so much so that he wants
Speaker:to purchase the franchise name.
Speaker:He wants to purchase McDonald's.
Speaker:He feels like he can make it much bigger.
Speaker:To me, it was all, uh, inclusive.
Speaker:It was Irish to the Irish.
Speaker:It sounded Scotch to the Scotch.
Speaker:Uh, it was a typical, uh, English-American word.
Speaker:It flowed, McDonald's.
Speaker:It was easy for the kids to say and remember.
Speaker:And, uh, I liked the sound of it.
Speaker:It sounded, uh, wholesome and it sounded genuine, you know?
Speaker:Uh, I don't like these, uh, hmm, gimmick-type names, you know?
Speaker:Uh, burger this and burger that and, uh, all that kind of stuff.
Speaker:McDonald's It's got a nice-sounding name.
Speaker:Sounds like Tiffany's
Speaker:And the, the brothers don't want the quality to suffer.
Speaker:They don't really want to do that.
Speaker:Um, but they're willing to sell their name and, and for him to, to
Speaker:try, but they're happy just staying where they are in San Bernardino.
Speaker:Yeah,
Speaker:with the, with the one or two spots where they're at.
Speaker:So they sell him McDonald's, and they sell him, uh, a, a handshake
Speaker:agreement where they will make 1% of all the franchise profits.
Speaker:Yeah, and when you say sell, like they li- there was literally
Speaker:just a handshake between them.
Speaker:Just a handshake.
Speaker:Right?
Speaker:Which looking back on it now, everybody nowadays, because I think our- we're
Speaker:a little more litigious nowadays.
Speaker:Mm-hmm.
Speaker:But we would like, "Yeah, we would never do that. You would never not put it on
Speaker:paper," but this is, when did he do this?
Speaker:The '50s?
Speaker:Mid-'50s?
Speaker:Yeah, so I think he buys it in 1954.
Speaker:Yeah.
Speaker:He met- well, he meets them in 1954.
Speaker:Uh, and he wants… They want to stay small.
Speaker:The brothers want to stay small, so in n- 1961 he buys the business from the
Speaker:brothers and continues to grow McDonald's.
Speaker:But this is where it goes bad.
Speaker:Because the brothers want to stay small, they want to stay in this
Speaker:original restaurant and keep selling their food and doing- At this
Speaker:spot in San Bernardino
Speaker:in San Bernardino.
Speaker:And so it's not a part of the deal, where Ray Kroc thinks it is a part of the deal.
Speaker:He thinks this original restaurant location is part
Speaker:of the deal, but it's not.
Speaker:Yeah, again, so th- both sides made the mistake of not putting certain things
Speaker:that they actually wanted on paper.
Speaker:I think the McDonald's brothers made a bigger mistake by not, by not, like,
Speaker:solidifying the handshake deal, 'cause the handshake deal between them was, like,
Speaker:one or 2% of profits or something like- 1%
Speaker:1%. And think about 1% of what McDonald's makes.
Speaker:That's bananas.
Speaker:Bananas.
Speaker:And so Ray Kroc is upset that he doesn't get that original building, and so
Speaker:he doesn't honor the 1% profit deal.
Speaker:They never speak again.
Speaker:The McDonald's brothers take him to court, and they, Ray Kroc wins because
Speaker:they can't prove it, and he m- now at the time has a lot of money behind him.
Speaker:And so this original location can't, uh, show the symbol.
Speaker:They can still be McDonald's, but they can't fr- they, they can't, like, sell
Speaker:the McDonald's brand that they started.
Speaker:And they have to re- they have to change the name of their restaurant.
Speaker:Yes.
Speaker:They have to do… So it's, it's a bitter, bitter… And it always stays that way.
Speaker:And that's why you'll get the original McDonald's restaurant in Downey.
Speaker:They make a big deal.
Speaker:Like, it's on Wikipedia that way.
Speaker:The f- store number one museum is in Illinois, even though it opens 15
Speaker:years after this San Bernardino store.
Speaker:So again, McDonald's really wanted nothing to do with this.
Speaker:However, in the '80s, they gave this, this…
Speaker:The, the city tried to revitalize this location and put original
Speaker:McDonald's location with the sign that has the M symbol on it, and
Speaker:McDonald's allowed them to do that.
Speaker:Uh, the c- the McDonald's brothers had p- passed and Ray Kroc had allowed
Speaker:this to happen at this location.
Speaker:And then that business, that location didn't do very well, and it was
Speaker:bought by another business owner who wanted to turn it into a museum, and
Speaker:that's when Ray Kroc and McDonald's was like, "No, you can't do that.
Speaker:It's not the original store.
Speaker:The original store is in Downey." But they, part of the buying of the
Speaker:location is they bought that sign with the McDonald's M on it, so now they're
Speaker:allowed to franchise and sell magnets and-
Speaker:So, so they, they
Speaker:essentially- … postcards-
Speaker:Yeah, so they owned- … with the M … so because… Now, the, the guy
Speaker:who came in, now a- as I understand it, the original restaurant-
Speaker:Mm-hmm
Speaker:kind of eventually kind of went into disrepair.
Speaker:Yes.
Speaker:And I think they knocked it down and turn, and built like a music
Speaker:store or something like that, which eventually turned into the museum.
Speaker:Yes.
Speaker:And so they were trying to revitalize it.
Speaker:They got the sign out front.
Speaker:So they got the sign, and I'll… And for those watching the video,
Speaker:I'll put clips of the sign.
Speaker:Mm-hmm.
Speaker:And you'll see the golden arches with McDonald's- Yeah … right through
Speaker:the, the bottom two parts of the arch.
Speaker:It says, "Historic site of the original McDonald's," and
Speaker:has the original McDonald's M
Speaker:on it.
Speaker:And, and it's interesting.
Speaker:So the guy who bought this location- Yeah.
Speaker:Albert … he was a, he was a businessman in the greater Los Angeles area.
Speaker:He's known as like the Chicken King- Mm-hmm … of Southern
Speaker:California, and it was Albert Okura.
Speaker:Yes.
Speaker:Now, I thought it was interesting that here's another fellow restaurant
Speaker:business- businessman in SoCal.
Speaker:He probably knew a little bit of that history.
Speaker:'Cause think about it, like, if you're running restaurants in SoCal, and
Speaker:if he was well established enough to start buying land, he eventually,
Speaker:like, bought a city somewhere else.
Speaker:Yes.
Speaker:Um, Amboy And so he probably knew a little bit of this.
Speaker:He was savvy enough to buy this location and then turn it into a
Speaker:museum, and then he owned the symbol.
Speaker:And so like you said, and you said it well on the video, McDonald's
Speaker:was not happy about that.
Speaker:They, they were not happy, and they came after him, and he- but he won- Mm-hmm
Speaker:because that came with the property.
Speaker:Yeah.
Speaker:So he- they owned that sign, and they were able to put it on merchandise.
Speaker:So that I thought was really interesting.
Speaker:It's kind of just a little jab to the, to how things went down for- at McDonald's.
Speaker:Um, and then of course, the inside of the museum was really cool too.
Speaker:So it's neat.
Speaker:So what's neat about this museum is it's free.
Speaker:It's along Route 66.
Speaker:It's free to go in.
Speaker:It's open 10:00 to 5:00 every day, and everything they have
Speaker:in there has been donated.
Speaker:And they have a lot.
Speaker:And they have a lot.
Speaker:And as a former McDonald's employee, Scott alluded to, I worked at
Speaker:McDonald's through high school and college, uh, they have Happy Meal toys.
Speaker:They have uniforms.
Speaker:And it's, like, from the '60s, '70s, ei- like, from the '70s through today.
Speaker:Uh, they have stuff from the playgrounds.
Speaker:They have stuff from the parties you would go to when you did
Speaker:your birthday parties there.
Speaker:They have, uh, ads that ran in papers.
Speaker:They have all the Happy Meal boxes.
Speaker:Yeah.
Speaker:It's just so amazing and nostalgic to go in and see all of that.
Speaker:They have the- one of the things that I thought was so cool that I really wasn't
Speaker:expecting was the little merry-go-round that they used to have with, like, these
Speaker:little kinda Hamburger looking- The
Speaker:Fry Man
Speaker:or something … Fri- Fry Man or whatever like that.
Speaker:But I remember being a kid, riding on these things, and climbing around in the
Speaker:Hamburglar jungle gym, and all this stuff, and the tree with the mirror on the back.
Speaker:It was, it was very nostalgic for you and I. You and I were loving it.
Speaker:We loved it, and it had all those toys through the, uh, years, like the '70s, and
Speaker:the '80s, and the '90s, and it was neat.
Speaker:They showed, like, s- a lot of their campaigns, Mac the Knife.
Speaker:Like, they, a lot of things that they did to sell McDonald's,
Speaker:and the, the, they sponsored the Olympics, and things like that.
Speaker:So it was really neat to walk through and see all that.
Speaker:But what's also cool is they had some memorabilia from the movie The Founder.
Speaker:And when we talked to Marvin there, Marvin told us originally they were
Speaker:coming through to make a documentary.
Speaker:Mm-hmm.
Speaker:And when they were coming through to make the documentary, they realized
Speaker:that McDonald's wasn't going to let them tell the truth th- about what
Speaker:really happened there, and they would probably have some litigation going
Speaker:on, so they decided to make it a movie.
Speaker:A fiction movie.
Speaker:And because of that, then they could just take the liberty and
Speaker:s- and tell what really happened.
Speaker:And because Marvin said it so well depicts what happened to the McDonald brothers
Speaker:that they embraced it there at the museum, and they really helped them find original
Speaker:printings of the original Speedees and things like that to use in the movie.
Speaker:And so they have a lot of those artifacts in a display case there.
Speaker:That's cool.
Speaker:So you can kinda see, uh, that story.
Speaker:So that's when… And Marvin is just a wealth of knowledge.
Speaker:I interview him on the video.
Speaker:He really can tell this story very succinctly and
Speaker:understand what happened here.
Speaker:But it's just, for those of us who just love McDonald's, and it's so much a part
Speaker:of our childhood, and we really think of it, like, so lovingly, it really
Speaker:is a sad story that happened between Ray Kroc and the McDonald brothers.
Speaker:Yeah, I mean, it's kind of a classic kind of capital, ca- uh, eh, I wanna, I don't
Speaker:wanna call it capitalistic, but it's, it's really, like, that free enterprise and,
Speaker:and just this kind of knock, knock-down, drag-out fight betw- you know, between
Speaker:founders and all this business stuff, and there's a ton of money because
Speaker:the franchise obviously was doing well when Ray Kroc was kind of starting to,
Speaker:you know, the, they started separating and they stopped, stopped talking.
Speaker:And so it was just so interesting to learn this history about McDonald's
Speaker:when here in America, you know, folks in our generation, we've grown up
Speaker:with it, and even our parents have prob- … have grown up with it.
Speaker:Seven great ingredients working together to make one great taste.
Speaker:Two all-beef patties, special sauce, cheese, lettuce, pickles,
Speaker:onions, on a sesame seed bun.
Speaker:Get the idea?
Speaker:Two all-beef patties, special sauce, lettuce, cheese, pickles,
Speaker:onions and a sesame seed bun.
Speaker:It's your McDonald's Big Mac.
Speaker:You've gotta taste it to believe it, you know what I mean?
Speaker:Two all-beef patties, special sauce, lettuce, cheese,
Speaker:pickles, onions and a sesame
Speaker:seed bun.
Speaker:And, uh, it, it was just a really, really interesting bit of history that
Speaker:I was not expecting along Route 66.
Speaker:Right there in San Bernardino, California, not, I was probably, like, 20 minutes,
Speaker:30 minutes from where I grew up.
Speaker:And it's neat, uh, you, our kids loved it, uh, and it was a great stop.
Speaker:And like I said, it's free, but what's really neat, they allowed us
Speaker:to leave a sticker there and- Yeah,
Speaker:on
Speaker:the outside, they've got like a sticker wall
Speaker:on the outside of… So that was neat, to know that we left Walk- A Walk
Speaker:With History sticker on the original McDonald's, and how much McDonald's
Speaker:meant to me growing up and, uh, to my family, and I know to Scott too.
Speaker:Like, it's just so much a part of our childhood.
Speaker:Uh, when you even think about how much those toys and glasses and
Speaker:plates, like, you just used them throughout your, uh, growing up.
Speaker:It was just really neat.
Speaker:Yeah, and one of the other things that they kinda called out there is one,
Speaker:other former employees was, like, Jay Leno- … And Andie MacDowell and-
Speaker:Uh, Rachel McAdams
Speaker:… Rachel McAdams, and you know, one of the Wayans brothers-
Speaker:Mm-hmm … and stuff like that.
Speaker:But they also have, and he mentions that most of their video, uh, visitors are
Speaker:actually not from the United States.
Speaker:He said Brazil is a huge, huge market for McDonald's, and so they actually
Speaker:have another section of this little museum from toys from other countries.
Speaker:So that was really neat.
Speaker:They had them from Austria, from literally all over the world.
Speaker:Mm-hmm.
Speaker:Brazil and the Indonesia, and e- I mean, just kinda everywhere- Yeah, Asian
Speaker:countries
Speaker:which was, which was just kinda neat and something that I hadn't considered.
Speaker:Um, and it makes sense, right?
Speaker:If you're gonna be from a- another country and you're gonna come visit the
Speaker:United States, well, you might go to Los Angeles to do Hollywood and this,
Speaker:that, and the other, but you might come here to drive out to San Bernardino and
Speaker:see the original McDonald's location.
Speaker:Like, and I'm sure you know, when I was in the Middle East in Dubai, I
Speaker:remember having McDonald's in Dubai.
Speaker:Yeah.
Speaker:Right?
Speaker:And there-
Speaker:We had McDonald's in Rome- We had … on our honeymoon Right?
Speaker:We were, like, in Italy, in Rome, and we just need- Right across from the
Speaker:Parthenon … we need- But yeah, right across from the Parthenon, right?
Speaker:Yeah,
Speaker:and- And it was, it, but it- I like that … the, the menu was a little bit different.
Speaker:And so there's McDonald's all over the world, and so everybody, people
Speaker:from all over the world come to this location and visit this, this museum.
Speaker:And just know, it's like, they, it's free, but they really rely on people, uh,
Speaker:helping them out and- Making donations
Speaker:making donations.
Speaker:And they take, everything in there has been donated, so if you have some
Speaker:McDonald's memorabilia sitting around or an old Happy Meal toy or old Happy
Speaker:Meal box, they wanna display that stuff.
Speaker:So if you have that stuff, package it up and send it in.
Speaker:Marvin loves to get it.
Speaker:They're actually looking to expand the museum and move, uh, get a little bit
Speaker:more space to show more of the things.
Speaker:But when you're outside, you can see the, the Hamburglar jungle gym, and
Speaker:there's a little Fry Guy out there.
Speaker:And because it's right along Route 66, they have some of
Speaker:those shields on the ground.
Speaker:So it's a great stop if you're driving the route, even if you're coming from
Speaker:LA and just wanna visit for the day.
Speaker:But, uh, it brought so much childhood memories back.
Speaker:I couldn't get the smile off my face while I was in there.
Speaker:It was, it was really cool, and it was fun to see, like, the old
Speaker:uniforms- Mm-hmm … 'cause they have stuff from, like, the '60s and '70s.
Speaker:And so I, one of the uniforms they had there was, like, that classic rust
Speaker:orange that was popular in the '70s, and it made me think of That '70s Show.
Speaker:Yes.
Speaker:Because I think one of the characters on That '70s Show probably worked in
Speaker:a fast food place and had that kind of, that style of, of uniform, and
Speaker:so that's what it made me think of.
Speaker:And so it, it does, it's a museum that's totally worth going if you're in the area.
Speaker:Um, it's a ton of fun.
Speaker:Yeah, it was a ton of fun.
Speaker:Uh, and as a former employee, uh, it brought back a lot of memories for me.
Speaker:I thank McDonald's.
Speaker:McDonald's gave me a great work ethic.
Speaker:Uh, and I really learned, uh, you know, I opened and closed
Speaker:for them all through college.
Speaker:They helped me out, I helped them out, and I really, really enjoyed working there.
Speaker:And I know that a lot of people will say, "I worked at McDonald's.
Speaker:I can't eat their food anymore." That's not me.
Speaker:I still love McDonald's.
Speaker:Good morning, America.
Speaker:Come join us for breakfast.
Speaker:You, you're the one.
Speaker:We're fixing breakfast for you.
Speaker:You, you're the one.
Speaker:At McDonald's, we're fixing a hot, delicious breakfast just for you.
Speaker:Fresh scrambled eggs, hotcakes and sausage, our own egg
Speaker:McMuffin, lots of Danish pastries.
Speaker:Try 'em.
Speaker:At McDonald's
Speaker:As you walk out into the bright San Bernardino sunshine, leaving behind
Speaker:the vintage toys, the retro uniforms, and the towering golden arches,
Speaker:you realize this stop is about so much more than burgers and fries.
Speaker:It's a story of American ingenuity, the dream of two brothers who revolutionized
Speaker:roadside dining, and the ruthless ambition of corporate expansion
Speaker:that forever changed our culture.
Speaker:Thanks to Albert Okura and the team at the museum, this humble corner
Speaker:along Route 66 isn't forgotten.
Speaker:It remains a place where travelers from all around the world can
Speaker:reconnect with their own childhood memories while honoring the
Speaker:real pioneers who started it all
Speaker:From the riverbanks of St. Louis across the high plains through the desert
Speaker:Southwest, our Route 66 centennial journey has taken us through some of the most
Speaker:iconic chapters in American history.
Speaker:While we ended our Route 66 road trip here, this is not the
Speaker:end of our historic travels.
Speaker:Our next stop took us to the Hollywood filming location of the original Ten
Speaker:Commandments movie, through the infamous town of Tombstone, and eventually to the
Speaker:birthplace of the World War II WASPs.
Speaker:Make sure you're subscribed to Talk With History on your favorite podcast
Speaker:app so you never miss an episode or a hidden gem off the beaten path.
Speaker:We'll talk to you next time.
Speaker:Can I say I'm loving it?
Speaker:This has been a Walk With History production.
Speaker:Talk With History is created and hosted by me, Scott Bennie.
Speaker:Episode researched by Jennifer Bennie.
Speaker:Check out the show notes for links and references mentioned in this episode.
Speaker:Make sure you hit that follow button in that podcast player,
Speaker:and we'll talk to you next time.
